Saturday, 13 December 2008

A musical guide to the gay marriage debate

A short comedy musical on Proposition 8 (passed in California on election day banning gay marriage in the state) starring some big film-type people.

I know... I'm mixing politics and religion again. I really shouldn't do it. Interesting to hear what people think about the subject though... I expect there might be some raving extremes here - on both sides.

My problem is I don't know where I stand on the issue. Someone help me out?


Sam 13 December 2008 at 17:49  

You don't know where to stand on gay marriage? Or on the issue of Jack Black being allowed to do anything in public?

On the first, what could the problem possibly be? If you think homosexuality is wrong, well tough. Don't do it yourself, but why should personal views be allowed to compromise the rights of others? Equal rights apply to ethnic minorities, why should they not apply to those of a different sexual persuasion?

In terms of the Californian Proposition 8, it should be ruled unconstitutional because it discriminates against a public minority. The California Supreme Court made several such rulings prior to Proposition 8, and appeals to the state Supreme Court are ongoing.

On the second issue, Jack Black is second only to Ricky Gervais in the list of annoying, ubiquitous inexplicably popular "comedians" who should have stuck to what made them good.

PJ 13 December 2008 at 18:11  

I don't think you can ever fully separate politics and religion, aren't they both effectively about how to live our lives? It's in the interpretation that we come a bit unstuck...

Is this in essence a debate about semantics - marriage versus legal union? Is it the terminology or the ideology that is so contentious?

Marriage is synonymous with procreation, not possible for same sex couples, but what about adoption? What makes an ideal family, ideal parents? Surely it's love and a nurturing environment. Same sex couples are every bit as able to provide those.

The law should protect the rights of everyone regardless of sexuality. Until it can be proven beyond quesion that homosexuality is not a genetic predisposition (and I don't think it ever will) then how can we discriminate against it?

There are so many desperately unhappy 'traditional' marriages and families, let's not be so presumptious as to imagine that a man and woman who marry are any more likely to have a successful relationship than a same sex couple.

Polunskers 17 December 2008 at 00:57  

What exactly is your dilemma about this Malc?
I feel marriage is a convenient way to bind couples together, I agree it's helpful for the kids, and it removes economic responsibility from the state - that's why they are so keen on promoting it. The big dream and the big party is magic,that's why most couples go for it.
I'm all for love in all its forms, if anybody wants get married that's absolutely their right - what's it to you or me?

Shuna 17 December 2008 at 11:28  

I agree with PJ, I am not sure you can seperate politics and religion - your views on both shape your views on life.

Re gay marriage I have no problem with it. People fall in love - they want to commit to each other, share their lives. Sometimes people are attracted to members of the same sex - why should they be denied the same opportunities as others to make the same choices.

The Bible is so often used to support the view that same sex relationships are wrong. But if you look closely at the passages that mention it - the kind of relationships being spoken of are often abusive not loving.

As the video quite rightly points out the Bible says so much is wrong - I love the shrimp cocktail example! And yet we accept that there is nothing wrong with eating shellfish, wearing mixed fibres, or speaking to a mentruating woman, mildew in your house makes it unclean....the list goes on.

I have many LGBT friends who are Christian - their lives above all else are proof to me that God loves them as much as he loves me. They are the living testimony that their lives and loves are as important as mine.

Hope that helps - I belong to a group called Affirmation Scotland that supports LGBT Christians - you may find their website interesting:

For a different view try

Malc 21 December 2008 at 14:39  

For the avoidance of doubt, the "I don't know where I stand on the issue" was a throwaway line in an attempt to get some debate going. I was interested to hear whar peoples' views were and how they would put them across.

PJ makes a good point - is it just about semantics? As I grew up, the first five or so family weddings I went to were not only "straight" weddings but were religious ceremonies. That perhaps shapes my perception that marriage is - or perhaps, was - a religious institution... but I don't know if that excludes gay marriage. I suspect it doesn't. Am I then saying that any marriage that isn't religious isn't marriage? I don't think so... but I do think it is an interesting discussion to have.

I guess I'm not sure why "marriage" - which has been defined as "a union between a man and a woman" - is somthing that same sex couples want. If marriage represents an institution that doesn't accept your identity then why it is so important to get a piece of paper? Or is that what makes it important?


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